[Aki]

I've logged 110 hours as Engie, more than all other classes combined. So I think I know engie. Thoughts on the new toys.

Moving Stuff
Awesome. Just awesome. Makes offensive pushes finally possible and I'm looking forward to playing blue on some of the payload race maps now since there's a point to doing that. Honestly, this one change reforms the world of Engie.

Example - in our engie power map there's that table in the conference room. Each edge of the table has drawbacks and advantages - Now you can scoot it around on the table to keep the enemy team guessing the exact spot the sentry is in (which changes how they can edge.


Frontier Justice
Guaranteed death for spies who try sap and stab. I can rebuild the gun. The autocrits are fun boost. Wish it had a larger magazine as I often felt the 6 round mag was too small. then again, it can drop a spy or scout in one hit now. Thumbs up.

Wrangler
If you are alone this is useless. It burns through ammo too fast to withstand a dedicated rush. With the support of another engie though this quickly becomes murder. It's very easy to keep a wrangled gun operational because of that shield. If it isn't your gun you can hide inside the shield from any attack

Gunslinger
The mini sentry gets no respect. But it does get kills. Unlike the normal sentry, it's more a nuisance weapon than anything else. But it keeps scouts on their toes. What everyone seems to forget is you can still upgrade and maintain another engie's gun.



My current tactics of choice are the following - equip FJ and Gunslinger. On mike make sure the other Engies aren't equipping the Gunslinger. Get to the intel room, drop the mini sentry to keep the scout rush suppressed and then concentrate on getting the other engie's guns up. Once their nest is up I set my dispenser where allies don't have to make that trick jump onto the conference table to get healing. By then the mini is pretty beat up so I pop it and drop a new one out in the basement or down in the sewer. The thing is a nuisance but it lets my team know the attack is coming. Destroying it also forces the other team to reveal their presence in an area. I then assist in tanking another engie's gun in the intel room.

If the enemy refuses to attack I set a teleporter from intel out to the creek between forts and randomly drop the mini sentry out there somewhere for ambush kills. The occasional ambush kill with the shotgun occurs too.

[kar]

i killed a heavy medic combo with fj and the southern hospitality alone
im kinda wondering if the fj isnt over powered

[ChicagoMikey]

Nice write up.

I hate the new shot gun, 3 shots doesn't help unless you have amazing aim. Which doesn't help when you're trying to dodge rockets from a soldier, bombs from a demoman, and or trying to attack a scout.

[Famous Last Words]

Prepare for a long ass post:

Frontier Justice: Only useful to the Engineer who knows how to get kills, stay alive and shoot well. Three shells just isn't that great. It has the same base damage as the shotgun so if you're on defense the regular one might serve you better. Going onto offense then it might be useful but it's still not great. If you're taken down while carrying those revenge crits around well ya just lost 'em. And yes, you will die because you're now a very valuable target. Any Sniper worth his salt will take you out in a flash.

If the need arises in Sudden Death where the gun has just gone down but the Engineer is still around and a Medic is chilling with an Uber, you could uber the Engineer yo push back (if he's a good shot) but face it's you're most likely gonna die soon after that uber. If you actually are luck enough to survive then rebuild your gun.

In combo with the Wrangler this could work really well. In most cases it isn't. If you can work that Wrangler really well and get some kills you'll be alright for when your gun does go down and maybe kill whatever killed your gun. you're gonna want to stay away from it though the moment that you see people incoming or you're getting blown up with you lovely sentry.

In combo with the Gunslinger you are a nasty force if you can avoid being killed. Throw out those Mini Sentries in unexpected places, when it goes down you've got revenge crits! Use those to find a place to build your new Mini Sentry. This is very tricky and will require a ton of skill on your side with a lack of skill/coordination on the opposition.

The Wrangler: I thought it would be OP. At times it can be but it's really not as bad as I thought. The range on it is a bit much but inexperienced Engineers can be snuck up on just like Snipers. Go up on their flanks, take down the Engineer and kill his gun in the three seconds it can't do anything.

Do not use the Wrangler with the Gunslinger. Anyone who does this is a dumb ass. Seriously. That mini sentry doesn't do a whole lotta damage and you can't repair it. Just toss teh thing out and do something more useful instead of wasting your time wrangling that puny little thing.

To take down a Wrangler Engineer it depends on who is helping him and gun level. If he's got someone fixing his level 3 wrangled gun, you're fucked unless you can sneak up on 'em. Anything else being fixed by an ally while the Engineer is Wrangling wait for a level change then go for it. If there's no one fixing it a Heavy or a Pyro is the best bet.

Sentry lvl 1: 450~ Health
Sentry lvl 2: 540~ Health
Sentry lvl 3: 648~ Health
Mini Sentry: 300~ Health

Going with this, it would take roughly SEVEN rockets (630 at base damage, but they will most likely do more), FIVE stickies (600 base damage but some will most likely do more), or FIVE pipes (600 base damage but some will most likely do more) to take out a lvl 3. And all of those need to be direct hits. (Note: Crits don't effect buildings) When you factor in reload time for the Soldier an Uber is going to be gone. Demo isn't a bad choice if you can get those stickies off before the Uber goes away. Meanwhile with a Heavy it takes about two seconds (500 dps with the Minigun, 320 dps with Natascha) to take down a lvl 3 if every round is a hit, with either minigun. Pyro will do 200 dps with any Flamethrower. Give him four seconds and you're good. Homewrecker is a good option but the Flamethrower is a better one. Why? simply because you can damage other buildings and the Engineer. Even better if that Engineer whips out his Southern Hospitality to defend. Just get that Heavy or Pyro close with an Uber and your team is golden. Works better if you sneak up from behind though.

Can't get an Uber? Send that Pyro in. Give him a distraction and he can sneak up and toast those guns without a problem.

A note on Sentry Jumping: It's cool and bloody useful. There are a few ledges to put guns up in Hydro where the enemy team isn't going to stand a chance if you an build there.

The Gunslinger: Oh boy. Those little guns are just so cute, even if they are a bit useless in the wrong hands. When using the Gunslinger you need to be able to get behind enemy lines or in unexpected places, leave a gun then get your booty out of there. Don't stick around using the Wrangler. It's just not worth it, you can't repair, it's got a small damage output and you're most likely on your own. Drop it and run. Instead of trying to survive on your own go help out another Engineer with a lvl 3 and a Wrangler. Fix his gun and you'll be a stone wall as long as he's a good with the Wrangler. You can even watch the flanks for him. This is TEAM Fortress after all.

Your mini Sentry goes down? So what, build another in a different spot. Look for little ledges you can get to and put one there. Go for the unexpected and annoy the team. Be like a ninja.

Southern Hospitality: Damn that's cool look in wrench ain't it? Too bad it's pretty useless. Bleed is nice but the minute you're confronted by fire you might as well say goodbye. Also, no random crits. This is a downgrade from the basic wrench if anything.

Pyros are going to be essential to taking out Engineer nests in the future due to high damage output and good speed. If the Engineer has the Southern Hospitality it just makes the Pyro more deadly. Anyone using the Southern Hospitality and Wrangler will learn to kill Pyros on sight since they WILL be your greatest weakness if they can flank you. If you aren't using the Wrangler Pyros are still a force to be reckoned with when it comes to Engineer Nest destroying.

Moving Buildings: I think this has made the greatest impact on TF2 out of the whole update. Offensive pushes are a breeze. You can keep enemies on their toes by moving your gun around. Just brilliant Valve. You did something completely right.

tl;dr version: FJ mostly sucks unless you know what the fuck you're doing.
Wrangler can do some neat shit.
Gunslinger is made for ninja engineers.
SH is completely useless.
Moving Buildings is fucking awesome.
Don't use a Wrangler with a Mini Sentry you dumb shit.

[Apothecary Corbulo]

I find the Frontier Justice is actually quite a devastating weapon for the engie that hangs around his own sentry. A gun that will take a heavy down in 2-3 shots? Especially when an ubered heavy/medic come charging the intel?

Any engie worth a damn will have a dispenser behind him while he whacks away at the sentry being hammered by the heavy/medic. If done properly, the gun will last the majority of the uber finally dying right at the end and leaving an engie with at least a couple revenge crits. If he's a good shot, at LEAST the heavy will go down possibly the medic as well (or vice versa).

[Cold Fusion]

FJ all you need is aim. You don't need 1337 skill.. Although I do prefer the old shotty, because I just love it (IMO it's the most underrated combat weapon in tf2), the FJ has it's uses. It's pretty situational too, which is what it's designed to be (not a replacement like the blutsauger used to be for the normal syringe gun).

And @famous, I gotta disagree about the wrench. The bleed is nice for spahs. But yes, pyros killlllll you. Again though that's one of those situational weapons, so I don't mind it.

Would type more but gtg

[Famous Last Words]

Exactly aim is what you need for the FJ, which seems to be quite a lot to ask from most engineers.

[ApplesHaveFeelings]

I still go old school offensive engi ^.^ The mini sentry it just bleh........

[Apothecary Corbulo]

Originally Posted by ApplesHaveFeelings

I still go old school offensive engi ^.^ The mini sentry it just bleh........

WTF are you talking about?? I've YET to see you go engie. You're always roof camping when I see you. Demo or soldier.

[Cold Fusion]

Originally Posted by Apothecary Corbulo

WTF are you talking about?? I've YET to see you go engie. You're always roof camping when I see you. Demo or soldier.

Apples is a nub!

Offensive Engineer is still the best though. Especially with moving sentries. I use the normal weapons (pre-update weaps) and move my stuff around. I thought it was funny to see people walk into a lvl 1 sentry that wasn't there before, it's much better to see them walk into a lvl 3.